So Are You.
What's up with these blog posts describing people shying away from saying "I play D&D"?
I play a game, and on the box it says "Dungeons & Dragons".
If someone is nerdy enough to know and care that there are different versions of D&D, it only takes two more syllables to say "I play old school D&D". Give me a break - Hasbro lawyers aren't going to break into your dining room to confiscate your Gary Gygax books. Hasbro might repress their legacy PDFs, but they can't unpublish the past. We need to fight, not acquiesce. Only through our constant use of the term "Dungeons & Dragons" can we promote genericization of the trademark. As the Old School Rebellion, I see it as our duty to do this. D&D is just too awesome and too personal to let it be co-opted by the highest bidder. It's not a simple boardgame like Monopoly or Trivial Pursuit - it's a beautiful, creative, life-long hobby we share with our friends. The dirty secret Hasbro wants you to forget is that you don't have to buy anything from them (or anyone else) to play D&D.
There is no reason to cede D&D to Hasbro. The only reason I can think of to use a silly code word for D&D is for commercial publishing - and that's what the retro-clones are for, right? End of discussion.
I play D&D. We all play D&D.
We are D&D, and D&D is us.
Can I get an amen, brothers and sisters!?!?
ReplyDeleteOld School Rebellion beats the tar out of Renaissance for a label.
ReplyDeleteBut wait a second, I am not just D&D but Hasbro too: http://hillcantons.blogspot.com/2011/03/i-have-met-enemy-and-he-is.html
The dirty secret Hasbro wants you to forget is that you don't have to buy anything from them (or anyone else) to play D&D.
ReplyDeleteAbsolutely!
I am not just D&D but Hasbro too
ReplyDeleteHaha! Thanks for chipping in on the corporate takeover! We'll free up those legacy PDFs with your help!
As usual with this argument, you're completely missing the point, probably on purpose.
ReplyDeleteMy name is Barad and I play D&D. I have no interest in giving up its rightful name even though I don't play the latest version. I have not spent a penny on 4th edition material, and may never do so. I agree, I could probably play until I am senile with the material I already have. (some might suggest I am already senile, but that is another topic and would be threadjacking)
ReplyDeleteI don't see what the anger is with WotC/Hasbro trying to convince us all to get on board their latest version bandwagon. Just vote with your wallet. If they produce something that tickles my fancy, they'll get my gold. Otherwise, I'll just keep playing D&D.
I agree, I don't see the need for a secret code word the means D&D. This is just one gnome's opinion. I'm not looking to start a revolution, just roll some dice and have some fun.
This is not a Hasbro issue. Hasbro and WotC has never said a person can not call any edition or game-play style D&D. However, some pundits are being silly and making an issue out of something that is simply not there and by virtue of making an issue out of it, it becomes one...only not really, unless we let it become one. Honestly, its all really silly.
ReplyDelete"Hasbro might repress their legacy... but they can't unpublish the past."
ReplyDeleteDamn straight. Brilliant oratory.
Although I'd amend that thus:
"Hasbro might repress [a] legacy [they merely bought]... but they can't unpublish the past."
\m/
ReplyDelete@Dan: "missing the point, probably on purpose"
ReplyDeleteSo he's firing a warning shot?
Yo dude, I feel like ready to march on Mordor with an army of 200 brave soldiers now!
ReplyDeleteThat's all fine and everything, but what if I *like* 3rd and 4th editions? I enjoy the hell out of my Basic and 1st Eds, but I enjoy the newer stuff too. I have nothing against WotC/Hasbro nor against TSR back when they were giving us D&D coloring books.
ReplyDeleteBarad, folks were voting with their wallets at one point, when pdf of the old gaming materials were available for purchase. WotC/Hasborg pulled the pdfs after they discovered (shock!) that folks were passing around pdfs of 3e/4e on the internet without paying for them. They had to crack down on "piracy," although what illicit copies of 3e/4e had to do with the legacy pdfs of OD&D/AD&D/Basic etc. is beyond me.
ReplyDeleteThey did not stop the spread of those pdfs in any way shape or form, and indeed their proliferation is MUCH greater now (for all editions). Rather than get some income from the legacy pdfs (some is better than none for a bottom line, right?), they now get nothing from that stream, and ticked off that segment of customers all over again. WotC/Hasbro creates their own PR problems. There is no need to bury a legacy that does not truly compete with their latest games and tick off paying customers.
Where there is a demand, it will be met, one way or another. Why WotC/Hasbro doesn't want to meet the old school demand, by offering those pdfs again, I don't understand. There's practically no overhead (the usual publishing costs of printing books, marketing them, distributing them, etc.) or effort on their part. Its easy money, but they don't want it.
I bought practically every pdf that was available for the classic games when they were available, so it doesn't effect me at all (plus I have multiples of the rulebooks and modules in hard copy). But for folks who want to get in on the game, or simply to read the old games to see what they are about, or want to introduce someone else to them, the lack of pdfs is a hindrance. Sure, the clones are out there, but they are not the same thing as reading the original foundational documents of the hobby in all of their warty glory. That's not a knock on the clones either. The original books are the Dead Sea scrolls of role playing, and apparently WotC/Hasbro would prefer those scrolls to stay in their cave rather than be available for others to look at.
I love it, don't lower the rhetoric. Speak your mind.
ReplyDeleteBarad, folks were voting with their wallets at one point, when pdf of the old gaming materials were available for purchase. WotC/Hasborg pulled the pdfs after they discovered (shock!) that folks were passing around pdfs of 3e/4e on the internet without paying for them. They had to crack down on "piracy," although what illicit copies of 3e/4e had to do with the legacy pdfs of OD&D/AD&D/Basic etc. is beyond me.
ReplyDeleteThey did not stop the spread of those pdfs in any way shape or form, and indeed their proliferation is MUCH greater now (for all editions). Rather than get some income from the legacy pdfs (some is better than none for a bottom line, right?), they now get nothing from that stream, and ticked off that segment of customers all over again. WotC/Hasbro creates their own PR problems. There is no need to bury a legacy that does not truly compete with their latest games and tick off paying customers.
Where there is a demand, it will be met, one way or another. Why WotC/Hasbro doesn't want to meet the old school demand, by offering those pdfs again, I don't understand. There's practically no overhead (the usual publishing costs of printing books, marketing them, distributing them, etc.) or effort on their part. Its easy money, but they don't want it.
I bought practically every pdf that was available for the classic games when they were available, so it doesn't effect me at all (plus I have multiples of the rulebooks and modules in hard copy). But for folks who want to get in on the game, or simply to read the old games to see what they are about, or want to introduce someone else to them, the lack of pdfs is a hindrance. Sure, the clones are out there, but they are not the same thing as reading the original foundational documents of the hobby in all of their warty glory. That's not a knock on the clones either. The original books are the Dead Sea scrolls of role playing, and apparently WotC/Hasbro would prefer those scrolls to stay in their cave rather than be available for others to look at.
"The dirty secret Hasbro wants you to forget is that you don't have to buy anything from them (or anyone else) to play D&D."
ReplyDeleteJust to put another view, if we'd taken this attitude to the original publisher, there wouldn't necessarily be much in the way of an OSR because there wouldn't necessarily have been any later editions. Gygax and Kaye might have been less keen at the outset if they'd known too. How do we know the current publisher and its backers won't take that cash and put it into something stunning that we'll still be playing in 30-40 years?
I play Pathfinder, but when people ask me what I'm going to do this Sunday, I say "play D&D."
ReplyDeletePeople that care about "The Hasbro Owned Brand" over gameplay need a cockpunch.
@mxyzplk: I'll try to remember that the next time I am playing 3rd or 4th ed with my kids and we are having a great time.
ReplyDelete*I* am Spartacus!
ReplyDeleteI mean... *I* Play D&D. In all it's forms.
That's all fine and everything, but what if I *like* 3rd and 4th editions?
ReplyDeleteI officially endorse you playing whatever games you love most! It's awesome your kids are into it!
It's too bad that when your kids grow up Exxon (or whatever company owns D&D at that time) will be repressing the old 4th edition game they used to love playing with their dad. At least one of them might get to inherit your old books...
That's the way to go. If other variants are what you identify with go ahead and use them too. I mean if i'm going out to play Stormbringer its not cool to say I'm playing D&D, but I say I'm going out to play D&D, when I'm really playing Pathfinder, all the time. In fact I Identify PF with D&D more than TETSNBN, so whatever.
ReplyDeleteI acknowledge it is extremely regrettable that older version's materials were made unavailable by WotC. Its a complicated problem, and their actions certainly do not make previous customers feel valued.
ReplyDeleteIt is certainly fair and relevant let WotC know that trust was broken, and ask "Why would I want to buy into another version that the company can stop supporting?"
Don't buy stuff from Hasbro--buy it from ME!
ReplyDelete@cyclopeatron: Hey, hey, hey, don't be spreadin' FUD about Exxon's plans for D&D™, I hear the GameTable™ generators will all make 30mpg at least.
ReplyDeleteI'm an equal opportunity lover of D&D, be it 4th edition or Rules Cyyclopedia, S&W or Mutant Future. What WotC does at this point will no longer dictate what D&D is to me. At most, it will merely add to the definition.
ReplyDeletePsychologist: So, do I understand that you feel abandoned by your big brother Hasbro? Because he ignores the existence of your favorite old toy, and says you stole his new one?
ReplyDelete@Lord Stark: thanks for the enlightening comment
@Cyclopeatron: I agree though. Power to the people! We ARE D&D. (And RQ. And T&T. And CoC...)
I play D&D
ReplyDeleteTechnically it's called Castles and Crusades, but I say D&D.
I respect your enthusiasm and agree with most of your points, but remember Mike Mearls reads your blog.
ReplyDeleteHe is a hasbro employee first, then a gamer.
Re: Mike Mearls
ReplyDeleteHe is a hasbro employee first, then a gamer.
Hey, dude's gotta make a living...I don't like 4th edition, personally, but I think developing it for a living would actually be a pretty cool job.
That is almost Zen.
ReplyDeleteI'm just gonna leave this very appropriate link right here. Please make lots of t-shirts of it, mkay?
ReplyDeletehttp://i.imgur.com/ouLS3.jpg
[never fear, link isn't scary, promise.]